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#425373 - 06/07/08 10:23 PM New Route ideas for Bee Line
TheGreatOne2k7 Online   content
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what do you think of these route ideas

#22 205 St Subway via Bainbridge Avenue to Cross County Shopping Center. This route won't be stuck under Jerome Avenue and it's traffic.

#23 238 St Subway to Getty Square via 238 St/Nereid Ave, Mclean Ave, and South Broadway (full Mclean Avenue crosstown)

#24 238 St Subway to Yonkers Raceway (possibly Cross County shopping center as well) via 238 St/Nereid Ave, Mclean Ave, and Central Park Ave. Route could also terminate inside Yonkers Raceway area near the door for customer convenience.

#44 EXPRESS Pelham Bay - White Plains via 45 route to Eastchester Square via 40/41 route to White Plains making all stops to New Rochelle, then EXPRESS stops to White Plains Trans Center


#23 could also be accomplished by extending the #5 or #6 to 238 St Subway via South Broadway, Mclean Av, and 238 St
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#425374 - 06/07/08 10:35 PM Re: New Route ideas for Bee Line [Re: TheGreatOne2k7]
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Of all the routes you proposed imo, your W-23 Mclean Ave crosstown is the best and most real of all those listed of ever coming to fruitution.

All the others you listed above Bee Line management will state that they all 'redudant' of existing routes ie #22 to the 20/21,
23/24=25 and the #44=45 and 40/41. Not a knock against your ideas Greatone just being honest.

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#425384 - 06/07/08 11:41 PM Re: New Route ideas for Bee Line [Re: R-7 SEPTA Local]
B35 via Church Offline
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of course dadbo will come & shoot down his ideas just because.....


anyway, GreatOne...
your #23 & #24 are good ideas for the most part, IMO...


that #22 I think would fail due to the fact that Bainbridge av is nowhere near the commercial area that Jerome av is.. tooooo much of the route's ridership would rely on ppl coming from the D line... and once your route reaches woodlawn, chances are ppl. would (still) wait for the #20/#21 - or already be on it (taking a ride/walk to jerome)... lol...

that #44 express to white plains is rather drawn out... it pans out to the immediate east (along pelham rd), then it has to swing back north & west, to white plains rd... nah.. that's not practical (especially for a suburban express route)... I'm not too sure the demand is there for such a route in the NE bronx anyway...
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#425425 - 06/08/08 11:52 AM Re: New Route ideas for Bee Line [Re: B35 via Church]
mta36 Online   content
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well I 'm going to defend Dadbo on this on,


there used to be a 24 running on Mcclean to 238th street that was canceled, I rememebr this route because Bee-line used to still have the route on it's transfers even though the route was canceled for many years. it was the McClean avenue cross town that ran on Hall place as well if i'm not mistaken. I believe the 1991 or 89 Beeline map still showed this route (in light blue Indicating PT service).

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#425426 - 06/08/08 11:56 AM Re: New Route ideas for Bee Line [Re: mta36]
mta36 Online   content
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too add to the creativity that exists on here how about this proposal.


a FULL length fordham route that connects via fordham to every train route and run up pelhma bay to pelhamdale road, up wolf or 5th (pelhma RR station) then follow the 7 route to new rochelle with a PT express to WP?

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#425437 - 06/08/08 03:00 PM Re: New Route ideas for Bee Line [Re: mta36]
TheGreatOne2k7 Online   content
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An alternative is to have #44 go on I-95 after New Rochelle and run up the Platinum Mile with #62, since some #62 buses can have standees (at least in the afternoon)
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#425439 - 06/08/08 03:07 PM Re: New Route ideas for Bee Line [Re: TheGreatOne2k7]
TheGreatOne2k7 Online   content
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The #22 can turn on Gun Hill to get to Jerome if needed, so the #20, #21, and #22 would stop at the same stop at Woodlawn. This is a test to see how Bainbridge service would work vs Jerome, since many people could take the (4) to Woodlawn, the #22 would be any extra future service increases the #20 would get, except would be more reliable (N/B) due to not being on Jerome for so long.
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#425449 - 06/08/08 05:10 PM Re: New Route ideas for Bee Line [Re: TheGreatOne2k7]
B35 via Church Offline
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 Quote:
An alternative is to have #44 go on I-95 after New Rochelle and run up the Platinum Mile with #62, since some #62 buses can have standees (at least in the afternoon)


well, that does tend to make more sense than your *original* "BL-44" express idea.....

I'm not too sure, but how often does the BL-62 express run anyway?



 Quote:
The #22 can turn on Gun Hill to get to Jerome if needed, so the #20, #21, and #22 would stop at the same stop at Woodlawn. This is a test to see how Bainbridge service would work vs Jerome, since many people could take the (4) to Woodlawn, the #22 would be any extra future service increases the #20 would get, except would be more reliable (N/B) due to not being on Jerome for so long.

I figured that was your motive...

If that's the case, then send some (extra future service increased) BL-20's along Bainbridge...
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#425453 - 06/08/08 05:48 PM Re: New Route ideas for Bee Line [Re: B35 via Church]
TheGreatOne2k7 Online   content
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#44 could still work making only transfer stops (3 stops) along #45 route after New Rochelle, which would cut down on the travel times.

#44 stops
All stops from Pelham Bay to New Rochelle Transit Center

EXPRESS (skips Iona College)
5th Avenue #45, #45Q, #61 (get off here for Iona College and walk or transfer to the #45Q)
Quaker Ridge Road #45, #45Q
White Plains Road #40, #41
Post Road #40, #41 (White Plains Hospital)

All stops to White Plains TransCenter (or non stop to TransCenter depends upon ridership patterns)

It depends upon how many people currently transfer between 40/41 and 45 during the rush hour...
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#425459 - 06/08/08 06:08 PM Re: New Route ideas for Bee Line [Re: TheGreatOne2k7]
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Greatone i actually 'railfaneed' it a couple of times over last year (taking the #40/41 from WP Post Road-Eastchester Road) and at most it's only 5-6 riders per trip.

As B-35 said which i agree it make more sense for the #44 to run via Interstate 95/287 then up WP Post Road.
Or better idea is just expand the service hours of the #40 'express' including 'reverse' commutte service for first time.

Even the current #45 during rush hours from years occasional railfanning it(mostly when i still lived in Brooklyn)has never been 'sro.'(standing room)
Nice try Greatone your #44 is not a great idea.


Just to compare, I have seen SRO #60 mainly in section between New Rochelle and White Plains.

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#425460 - 06/08/08 06:40 PM Re: New Route ideas for Bee Line [Re: R-7 SEPTA Local]
TheGreatOne2k7 Online   content
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There are 4 #62 buses in the AM and 3 #62 buses in the PM...

If an increase were needed (since I did see a #62 with 2 standees although about 4-5 seats were left on that run) it would be an option of some more #62 service, or new #44 service (could start out with 2-3 runs in each direction 30 minute headways reverse peak direction) via I-95 which could create new travel patterns from Pelham Bay and the East Bronx.

The new #44 would be slotted in to alternate with #62 leaving White Plains Transit Center in the PM and leaving New Rochelle Transit Center in the AM (as best as possible).

The schedules could also be modified to make sure 40/41 and 45 meet more often at Eastchester Square.
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#425463 - 06/08/08 07:36 PM Re: New Route ideas for Bee Line [Re: TheGreatOne2k7]
mta36 Online   content
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we tend to forget that 3/4 of Bee line routes run in residential areas basically only the 20 runs on the BUSINESS route. However there are a few options regarding bronx service.


Fordham road pelham bay connection.

if another option is at pelhma bay that can take you up to WP or New Rochelle then more riders would feel comfortable riding up to pelham bay. the issue with the 45 is that riders feel the route and the schedule is useless to them basically saying if you miss the 45 your stranded due to the fact that on the 6 train there is only ONE BUS and that is the 45.


The 52 is another situation this line could further serve the bronx and probally would see ridership increase

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#425471 - 06/08/08 08:11 PM Re: New Route ideas for Bee Line [Re: TheGreatOne2k7]
dadbo46 Online   content
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 Originally Posted By: TheGreatOne2k7
#44 could still work making only transfer stops (3 stops) along #45 route after New Rochelle, which would cut down on the travel times.

#44 stops
All stops from Pelham Bay to New Rochelle Transit Center

EXPRESS (skips Iona College)
5th Avenue #45, #45Q, #61 (get off here for Iona College and walk or transfer to the #45Q)
Quaker Ridge Road #45, #45Q
White Plains Road #40, #41
Post Road #40, #41 (White Plains Hospital)

All stops to White Plains TransCenter (or non stop to TransCenter depends upon ridership patterns)

It depends upon how many people currently transfer between 40/41 and 45 during the rush hour...


Actually had a route similar to that years ago. Route #44 the "Tom Paine Express." Ran up North Ave. to mthe Post Rd. then north on the Post Rd. I just don't rtemember what it did when it got to White Plains.

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#425478 - 06/08/08 08:20 PM Re: New Route ideas for Bee Line [Re: dadbo46]
mta36 Online   content
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that route came outta the Bronx Dadbo?


I remember the old #24 route (on paper).


there were several other routes that was still on maps but was cancelled.


The BxM4D - Tarrytown?

the #36 NWP virgina road

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#425483 - 06/08/08 08:28 PM Re: New Route ideas for Bee Line [Re: mta36]
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Oh MTA36 i can tell you that.

The BXM4d i believe was a rush hour 'extra service' of the current BXM4c that ran to Tarrytown and the Westchester Medical Center. I assume it was cancelled due to low ridership.

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#425495 - 06/08/08 11:06 PM Re: New Route ideas for Bee Line [Re: R-7 SEPTA Local]
TheGreatOne2k7 Online   content
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#45 has artics at times, so it must be busy enough to warrant artics and 30 minute headways on weekdays
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#425576 - 06/09/08 08:00 PM Re: New Route ideas for Bee Line [Re: R-7 SEPTA Local]
B35 via Church Offline
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 Originally Posted By: R-7 SEPTA Local
Oh MTA36 i can tell you that.

The BXM4d i believe was a rush hour 'extra service' of the current BXM4c that ran to Tarrytown and the Westchester Medical Center. I assume it was cancelled due to low ridership.


damn...

I mean, I don't know...

are you saying that old BxM4d went to the medical center... tarrytown, en route to where the (current) BxM4c ends @ (around 23rd st/5th av)...

or did it terminate elsewhere in manhattan?

regardless, I can see why such a route would be discontinued.....
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#425582 - 06/09/08 08:12 PM Re: New Route ideas for Bee Line [Re: B35 via Church]
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 Originally Posted By: B35 via Church
 Originally Posted By: R-7 SEPTA Local
Oh MTA36 i can tell you that.

The BXM4d i believe was a rush hour 'extra service' of the current BXM4c that ran to Tarrytown and the Westchester Medical Center. I assume it was cancelled due to low ridership.


damn...

I mean, I don't know...

are you saying that old BxM4d went to the medical center... tarrytown, en route to where the (current) BxM4c ends @ (around 23rd st/5th av)...

or did it terminate elsewhere in manhattan?

regardless, I can see why such a route would be discontinued.....


I am sure our friend Dadbo can confirm this. I am 90% sure it ran to either Tarrytown or Westchester Medical Center as it Westchester terminal.

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#425583 - 06/09/08 08:13 PM Re: New Route ideas for Bee Line [Re: B35 via Church]
B35 via Church Offline
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didn't see your original post here:

 Originally Posted By: mta36
a FULL length fordham route that connects via fordham to every train route and run up pelhma bay to pelhamdale road, up wolf or 5th (pelhma RR station) then follow the 7 route to new rochelle with a PT express to WP?


I thought about something like that; a route that went from MNRR Fordham (that general area) over to New Roc'... I'm not too sure about sending such a route to WP, though...

when I used to ride the BL-45 regularly (meaning, not for no fantrips or w/e), I've always felt this way:

 Quote:
the issue with the 45 is that riders feel the route and the schedule is useless to them basically saying if you miss the 45 your stranded due to the fact that on the 6 train there is only ONE BUS and that is the 45.


coming from Brooklyn, I had to ride the full length of the 6 train every morning to catch that damn bus... and to ppl. saying it has low ridership... guess again...

my gripe/point is, it should venture elsewhere into the Bronx (Ideally, Fordham rd), not that sole, isolated connection to the 6 @ PBP...

I'm almost certain that if the Bx12 & the BL-45 paralleled each other along pelham pkwy, more riders will utilize the route (the 45, I'm referring to)....
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#425587 - 06/09/08 08:20 PM Re: New Route ideas for Bee Line [Re: B35 via Church]
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Or why not have the W-45 also start/terminate at Bay Plaza?
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#425598 - 06/09/08 08:39 PM Re: New Route ideas for Bee Line [Re: R-7 SEPTA Local]
B35 via Church Offline
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instead of PBP?

that's actually worse than what it currently does...



.....unless you're saying, have it serve PBP, then afterwards on up to Bay Plaza....

Problem w/ that is, not too many riders from co-op use the route to begin with... a westbound extension (even on over to Pelham Pkwy on the '2') would do the route some good....
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#425600 - 06/09/08 08:57 PM Re: New Route ideas for Bee Line [Re: B35 via Church]
mta36 Online   content
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 Originally Posted By: B35 via Church
instead of PBP?

that's actually worse than what it currently does...



.....unless you're saying, have it serve PBP, then afterwards on up to Bay Plaza....

Problem w/ that is, not too many riders from co-op use the route to begin with... a westbound extension (even on over to Pelham Pkwy on the '2') would do the route some good....




Exactly!

A westbound extension helps out the 60 as well and it connects the line with a Hospital that even westchester residents use ...JACOBI , ALBERT EINSTEIN. with it's western extension it can even have a quicker trip to the Depot (Highway 87)


this would give the line a excuse to have more frequent service. The trip to New rochelle is supposed to be quicker from PBP but if you miss the bus then that option is useless. meaning riders are safer trying to connectto the Metro North @ fordham Via the WB Bx12.


Option 2 could be to extend the route to parkchester or to story avenue K MART . etc but I think that would not gain ridership immediatley.

the fordham extension would work. I have seen a many of times riders thinking the W60 W61 went straight on Pelham Pkwy only to be turned away.


The experiment should be to have PT service run the length of fordham during the rush hours. from fordham the trip to new rochelle should be quicker than going up boston road. and if the 62 is already crowded @ fordham have that line run across Pelham Pky and Jump on 95 morth making that a super express. (just a suggestion) and have a express run from New rochelle maybe from the pelham bay stop ? who knows

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#425684 - 06/10/08 12:01 AM Re: New Route ideas for Bee Line [Re: mta36]
TheGreatOne2k7 Online   content
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What could be done is to reduce the midday headway at Pelham Bay to 30 minutes instead of 60 minutes if that would make a difference in ridership.
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#425991 - 06/12/08 09:23 PM Re: New Route ideas for Bee Line [Re: TheGreatOne2k7]
sebbieprops Offline
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My proposal for improving Westchester service would be to introduce a new Westchester route that would serve as an alternative to the Metro-North New Haven Line from the Bronx to New Rochelle. With Metro-North service as inadequate as it is, especially outbound on the New Haven line, the following route would be introduced, originating at Fordham Road:

- East Fordham, Pelham Pkwy, White Plains, West 1st, (stop at Mount Vernon East MNR), East Prospect, South Columbus, East Sandford (accessing the shopping center), Wolfs, 5th, (accessing Pelham MNR), Lincoln, North (ending at New Rochelle MNR).
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#425993 - 06/12/08 09:32 PM Re: New Route ideas for Bee Line [Re: sebbieprops]
R-7 SEPTA Local Offline
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 Originally Posted By: sebbieprops
My proposal for improving Westchester service would be to introduce a new Westchester route that would serve as an alternative to the Metro-North New Haven Line from the Bronx to New Rochelle. With Metro-North service as inadequate as it is, especially outbound on the New Haven line, the following route would be introduced, originating at Fordham Road:

- East Fordham, Pelham Pkwy, White Plains, West 1st, (stop at Mount Vernon East MNR), East Prospect, South Columbus, East Sandford (accessing the shopping center), Wolfs, 5th, (accessing Pelham MNR), Lincoln, North (ending at New Rochelle MNR).


Would it not be easier just to extend the W-42(New Rochelle-Mount Vernon-Wakefield)line to Fordham?

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